freshfeeling | Entries tagged with super smash bros. ultimate

In my first post about my Golden Sun with No Swords playthrough, I gave quite a bit of background information including the fact that it was born of hype for adding characters into Super Smash Bros. Ultimate. It's funny, because it was 2018 and Smash Ultimate was already out but there remained quite a bit of hype as the DLC characters were being gradually revealed. I was really excited for #GoldenSunday on November 11, 2018 and posted a ton on Twitter that day.

Twitter has changed since then, and since starting this blog ~15 months ago I've deleted all of my Twitter accounts. I don't have a lot of record of what I've posted, but I figured since I discussed posting a bunch of ideas related to an Isaac moveset I ought to share those here!
I remember most of the ideas, but the exact posts are lost... so I'm kind of re-constructing it here. Thankfully I naturally had a Google doc where I stored a bunch of links to ideas and images back in 2018, too.

General Characteristics and Gimmicks

There are two main gimmicks in play for this version of Isaac.
The first is that Isaac has a focus on earth- and ground-based attacks. When Isaac is in the air, several of his moves are different and generally weaker.

The second is that Isaac has consumable djinn (as I've designed this, there are 6), and his power for most purposes decreases very slightly as these are used. For most moves this would make a difference but not a huge difference: the downside is that Isaac has some psynergy-series based moves like Quake, Gaia and Spire: if Isaac uses 2 of his 6 djinn, he loses access to the highest charged version of these, and if Isaac uses 5 of his 6 djinn he loses access to the middle charged version of these. However, as in his games, the more djinn that are used give access to stronger elemental summons, which are Isaac's final smash.

This would end up having an interesting "feel", almost a bit like the Golden Sun games: using your power prepares you for summoning, but also weakens you, and the recovery process creates its own risk. Banjo & Kazooie have a mechanic of a purely finite resource; Isaac's would be recoverable, but with an inherent sort of risk to it. If you don't have a chance to break a smash ball, using djinn is risky.

Specials

Neutral Special: Djinn. This is Isaac's single most complex move, by a lot, tying into his general gimmicks. By pressing B, Isaac can press directions to activate some of his Venus djinn. The options are as follows:

Left/Right: Flint or Echo. These use a move similar to a side smash attack, but with additional power.
Up: Granite or Iron. These two are defensive djinn. These grant momentary immunity and a short period (~5 seconds) of significant knockback resistance.
Down: Ground or Mud: These two djinn drive a nearby opponent into the ground, as a Pitfall Seed.

As noted above, djinn used in this move are consumed and are restored only after a Final Smash.
The animation would begin with a djinn materializing overhead for all of these. If you maintain a B-press by holding it and are fully neutral / non-tilt for about 1 second - or if you have no djinn remaining - Isaac uses his signature Ragnarok psynergy instead, and the animation changes the materializing djinn into the sword projectile. Ragnarok is thus very slow to use. The version of it that would be called when Isaac has no djinn available would be significantly weakened.

Side Special: Move. As Isaac's assist trophy, basically, although perhaps slower since his assist trophy is on the strong side. Only one hand could appear at a time.

Up Special: Quake. This is entirely based on the wonderful illustrations that roydgriffin posted on Reddit in 2014. A chunk of earth would pop out below Isaac, propelling him into the air. If in the air, he would materialize it, which would have a lesser effect but still be functional as a recovery. Both would have hitboxes as well.
Because of this version of Isaac's djinn mechanics, it would be stronger depending on how many djinn Isaac had available, starting as Quake Sphere, then Earthquake, then Quake.

Down Special: Gaia. Gaia is just a burst of rocks and magma from the ground around Isaac, although obviously this wouldn't be as strong materializing in the air. As an advanced offensive psynergy, this also has its strength vary depending on available djinn: it starts as Grand Gaia, then reduces to Mother Gaia, and then Gaia. It would hit an area around Isaac when used on the ground, and would have a bit of a slow startup to compensate for its generous hitbox and reasonable power.

Final Smash: Summon. As noted above, Isaac's final smash would depend on how many psynergy are available.

Ramses is a non-cinematic final smash, used when Isaac has consumed 0-1 djinni. It is a strong, high-knockback attack in a forward direction from where Isaac is.
Cybele is a non-cinematic final smash too, used when Isaac has consumed 2-3 djinni. It is a very strong, multi-hit, high-knockback attack in an upward direction that hits just in front of Isaac's position.
Judgment is a cinematic final smash targeting characters in front of Isaac marked by some kind of dirt cloud. It is used when Isaac has consumed 4-5 djinn. It is very strong, providing damage that knocks the enemy to either side of the screen with power similar to other cinematic final smashes
Catastrophe is basically the same as Judgment but stronger. This would require Isaac to have used all 6 of his djinn.

All of these have deviations from Golden Sun's actual gameplay, notably in the number of djinn available and, in Catastrophe's case, the type. Sakurai's okay with that.

Smashes

Side Smash: Attack. A short-hop jumping slash, as his normal attack from the games.

Up Smash: Planet Diver. A short jump upward into a downward, fiery slash. I really thought about Death Plunge for this but I think Planet Diver fits the theming better. It could be either, they're pretty similar.

Down Smash: Spire. As in this art by laetranger on DeviantArt, columns of stone shoot out in both directions. One could also use vines but this is nice.
This could also be affected by Isaac's quantity of djinn that have been used, since Spire is a psynergy series. It could start at maximum as Stone Sphere, then Clay Spire, and then regular Spire. I think laetranger's art probably most resembles the minimal Spire version. It doesn't match particularly well with the Golden Sun games though, where the Spire series is more like stalactites striking from above rather than stalagmites from below.

Neutral, Tilts, etc.

Jab. He would punch, where some of the rapid punches are replaced with rocks and/or yellow psynergy hands.

Dash: Attack. This would closely resemble his side smash, like a normal attack from the games.

Side Tilt. A sword swing. Or, hey, maybe a mace swing!

Up Tilt: Punji. Bamboo spikes would quickly rise up directly on Isaac and slightly in front.

Down Tilt: Tremor. A minor rumbling earthquake hits enemies directly around Isaac for minimal damage.

Aerials

Neutral air. Kind of like Gaia or Rockfall, or perhaps resembling what Aang did in his battle with Fire Lord Ozai, small rocks would float and circle around Isaac in a band.

Forward air: Cutting Edge. A slash with a big blue energy wave; for Smash purposes, this should not be as projectile-like as it appears in the game.

Up air: Cyclone. A small, weak tornado surrounds Isaac and moves up slightly before dissipating.

Back air. A cloud of dust is released behind Isaac for minor damage in a large hitbox.

Down air: Rockfall. A boulder is released downward. It cracks upon contact or crumbles after a short distance.

Grabs and Throws

In general, the large, yellowish flashing hands are used in Isaac's grabs. The hand is materialized as his throw. As a tether recovery, if there is no valid target and a ledge in range, the hand will form a rope and effectively use Lash. Most of the other functionality of grabs and throws is also based around Isaac's utility psynergy. For pummeling, the hand would grasp and squeeze.

Forward Throw: Force. The fast-moving fist hand strikes the enemy forward.

Back Throw: Scoop. A hand forms a scoop and throws the enemy backward.

Up Throw: Carry. A second hand appears and they pinch the enemy, lift them upward and then drop them.

Down Throw: Growth. Vines pull the gripped fighter to the ground. Growth is also a psynergy series, so it could be affected by Isaac's number of available djinn. It could also not seeing as the regular Growth psynergy is a utility psynergy that can be used by anybody with a specific equipped item. If it were designed to work based on unset djinn, the strongest version would be Wild Growth, the medium is Mad Growth, and the basic one is just Growth.

Taunts, Entry, Victories

Taunt 1. Isaac gets a exclamation mark

emote over his head like in conversations in his games.

Taunt 2. A Venus djinn appears and bounces around.

Taunt 3. An idea stolen from laetranger, a utility psynergy hand appears and does a thumbs up.

Intro. A spire of rock pops up and Isaac breaks out of it.

Victory 1. Levitates some tiny rocks around above his open hand.

Victory 2. Pose with Garet, Ivan and Mia.

Victory 3. Swings sword, generic action pose. Or it could use the psynergy hand thumbs up gag again.

As hype was building for Super Smash Bros. Ultimate in mid-to-late 2018, and continuing as DLC characters were being teased and introduced, I was very much an "Isaac stan", if there was such a thing. My Twitter timeline was abuzz with support for Isaac from Golden Sun as a playable character, with him and Shantae being my top picks to appear in the game.

I was a big fan of the "Grinch leak" during the short period where that was a thing!

I took the concept of fandom perhaps the furthest I've ever taken it on November 11th, 2018 for what the Golden Sun community on Twitter called #GoldenSunday. I posted reviews of some theorized Isaac movesets for Smash Bros. that had been proposed by fans across several communities, as well as my own take on a potential Smash moveset for Isaac.
I also wanted to refute the most common criticism of Issac in Smash that I had heard: Smash doesn't need another anime swordsman! And it's true, really, Smash is loaded with anime swordsmen. But I had considered Isaac very much as an earth-element master first.

As part of #GoldenSunday, I posted, "This gives me an idea for a fun challenge play, actually: Golden Sun 1+2 with no swords of any kind! Anyone done it?"

Without reply, eventually, I started... quite a bit later, in March of 2020. As of this writing, just over three years later, I haven't finished it nor even picked it back up for ages. I was playing on Wii U Virtual Console and lost my mojo for it (citing Animal Crossing New Horizons; can you blame me?). I think I may come back to it. It's not super easy to record or screenshot from a Wii U though.

The rules are: no character can use any sword in battle at any time. If there's ever a situation where a character is forced into battle with a sword, they can only use non-weapon-based actions. The Ragnarok and Odyssey psynergies are also banned, since they summon giant swords.

In terms of what I already did...

On March 16, 2020, I posted that I had started! "I’ve started this over the last few days, up to Xian. It’s not hard, but it’s slow. It sucks missing some early swords like Arctic Blade and depending on Battle Axes for a long time."

On May 24, 2020, I posted: "I played through Colosso and then got distracted by #ACNH. But Colosso was the most interesting part of Golden Sun with no swords! It meant doing the final opponent with only psynergy and items, which was a super close call!"

On Feb 24, 2021, I replied to something about non-sword-wielding characters in response to @theWellRedMage. "I have wanted Isaac for a long, long time. He wields swords, but uh can also use maces or axes, the sword isn’t necessary. I even did a Golden Sun 'no swords' run! And then he just won’t use his iconic Ragnarok attack. It’ll be fine!"
This was a bit of a lie, I think, as I don't remember going any further than Colosso.

At this point, about 3 years later, Colosso is the only thing memorable about the run so far. Colosso is probably a bit more than halfway through the first Golden Sun game, and you have Isaac alone and he's supposed to try to win a battle contest. The contestants race through an obstacle course, optionally picking up advantages of different sorts along the way, and whichever contestant reaches the battlefield in the middle of the arena first claims the most useful advantage - in the second round, it's a weapon. This is sort of a Hunger Games-like situation where you enter with nothing, and can choose to be direct and opt for violence... or gather a variety of assets with risk of your opponent entering the match with a strong weapon. Well, the weapon available in Colosso is a sword, of course, so I collected everything else and then attempted to win these solo battles using only Psynergy. I don't remember the details but I very much remember that last battle coming down to the wire!

What I can say about this so far is: while Isaac does have access to a variety of weapons, his game is very much designed around the use of swords! Avoiding swords isn't particularly challenging (besides Colosso, so far), but it certainly feels different. The next part of the game where I would expect to truly feel the impact of this limitation is near the end, as some of the highest-tier weapons in the game, such as the Gaia Blade and the Kikuichimonji, are swords.

Here are my stats at the Gondowan Passage, having never touched a sword: